Does Yamaha really sound bad? and why doesn't everyone like her?
Yes, I realized a long time ago and it is clear that you are far from a professional in this field, but since I am a meticulous person, I tried to get from you a more detailed description in all the details of the difference in the sound of these speakers. A competent radio engineer, just looking at the diagram of a device (amplifier or anything else), will tell in advance how it will work, without even listening or touching it live, and the frequency response graph can already be seen as approximately, with a high degree of probability , this acoustics will sound, because there is a direct relationship between the graph and its live sound, this is elementary physics, human ears work according to the same laws, just like the measuring microphone with which this frequency response was recorded. Why then are these graphs given if they are useless from an informative point of view? For those who are interested in this issue and have at least some knowledge of it, they will tell you a lot. And from personal experience I will say that the expectation of the listening result (by looking at the graphs) and the result itself almost always coincide in the main thing, everything else is minor nuances that do not make the main difference. And Soavo’s highs are like crazy, there is complete deafness, which is now called “neutral” and “correct” sound. Bad taste is being globally imposed on brainless ordinary people, driven people who are not accustomed to using their heads in all spheres of life, and this is done deliberately for the sake of habituation, primarily among young people. Do you often see something worthy musically on TV? But there really are just a lot of masterpieces in music, but the day and night is spent passing by worthless slag and bullshit, you only see what they allow you to see. Everywhere it is stated that the horizontal straight line in the frequency response is the “most correct” sound, and the straighter it is, the better))). So let’s completely abandon tone controls on all types of equipment, why are they needed if they “spoil” all sorts of sounds. I have a friend who listens to music in the toneless Pure Direct mode, he likes it that way, he has his own opinion on it. There are even coprophages who eat feces, and if you try to prove to him that this is not good or right, he will spit in your face. But these are not the bulk of the population, but a tiny percentage; why focus on those who are in the overwhelming minority? Music should sound beautiful and bring aesthetic pleasure, that’s what it serves. I am not a sound engineer or an audio analyst, I don’t need refined, sterile sound that is not “damaged” by anything, I don’t mix recordings at home and don’t write reports and articles about what I listen to, I’m a music lover, not an audiophile, always dissatisfied with something, clinging for any little thing, just to discredit what he hears and have something to scratch his tongue about, he doesn’t care WHAT is playing, even knock on a tambourine, he cares about HOW it plays and what he can get to the bottom of. For me, the main advantages of this acoustics are important, why it is remarkable and different from others and to what extent, I think this is a completely logical and reasonable approach. And my room is 12 square meters and the sound is excellent, I can move the speakers to another room, set it up and it will be just as good. Knowing the formula for calculating the resonance of a room (F=340/(2xL) and the basic concepts from the field of acoustics, you can achieve good sound in almost any room. You don’t even need to know much, everything is ridiculously simple. I theoretically calculated the resonance using 3 planes of the room, set the appropriate settings and tested it in practice, if necessary, moved the acoustics in the right direction, you can do everything in the reverse or random order, whichever is more convenient for you. !)))
From Hi-Fi to Hi-End: in search of an CD player
I present to your attention a piece of material, a real information bomb, dedicated to choosing an CD player. The author of the material is my good friend Vladimir, owner of the friendly website analogsound.rf (come in, don’t be shy), already familiar to you from publications about choosing vintage and modern acoustic systems. For those who missed it, immediately catch up by following the links In search of vintage acoustic systems and Modern acoustics from 30,000 to 250,000 rubles, or read them on Vladimir’s website analogsound.rf. Volodya and I often exchange interesting information, as we are united by a common hobby - researching high-quality vintage and modern audio equipment. Since one person is not able to cover the entire breadth of the range of once existing equipment, our research complements each other. His materials are just as objective as mine. There is no hidden marketing meaning or lip service in them; everything is as it is and is described. Because of this, the value of such articles greatly increases, the relevance of which remains for many years. I think even now it would be interesting for you to read a truthful publication about, say, the Philips CD-100 CD player produced in 1982, even if it was written 34 years ago - the truth remains true. But I think the advertising stuff of that time will interest few people now, unless you are interested in the history of marketing or are not trying to fool someone’s brain by selling something unnecessary. Therefore, I perceive what Vova writes in the same way as what I wrote. Over the course of several years, it became clear that our understanding of the class of sound and its features is indistinguishable. I recommended some models to him, and some he not only advised, but also sent me Pioneer M-90, Marantz PM-17 to listen to. Therefore, treat this material as rare information, arranged in such a condensed format with relevant comparisons and contrasts. You won’t read this anywhere, and to find out on your own will require several years of searching and very large financial costs. Find an article about choosing an CD player - from the cheapest to one that is not affordable for everyone.
From Hi-Fi to Hi-End: looking for CD players
In this article I will tell you how my attitude towards the sound source and my impressions of what I listened to changed. Almost all the models described were in my system. The prices that I will indicate are conditional, since all this happened at different times. SD is a source and is currently the main carrier. The story is common - I started with budget models and in the process non-budget ones appeared, but the search for my sound went on and continues, so there was a desire, based on accumulated experience, to highlight models that, despite their cost, were not inferior in level to more expensive models. The beginning was laid back in 2000. Having sold my receiver, I bought, after listening to the laudatory reviews of the seller in the showroom, what seemed to be a good Nad 320bee amplifier. I didn’t really listen to the device myself, but the standard epithets in 2000 sounded like spells: -From a leading manufacturer! -In honor of the Engineer! But for me the main thing then was that I stayed within the allotted budget, which sounded like “up to 10,000 is not a pity”!
Started choosing SD!
The choice took place in approximately the same vein. For the budget “it’s not a pity at all”, the amount has been determined to be 5tr! By chance, the choice was successful - the seller offered to compare simultaneously a Yamaha CDX-490, some Technics and a Sony, which were in the store at that time. All from one budget. We listened to the same disc. Sony dropped out immediately, the sound of a music center, with the clatter of a cheap Japanese device. Technics turned out to be a little better, but I liked the Yamaha CDX-490. She gave what I wanted to hear - depth, lack of color, and overall sound balance that justifies the Natural Sound slogan!
BOUGHT ! Yamaha CDX-490 5000r!
The Dali AXS5000 speakers were also purchased here as part of the kit. I sometimes listened to it without delving into it, and it seemed that the sound was good. Later it became clear that I was listening to hard rock discs that didn’t matter what to play on, as long as they screamed. It all stood like furniture, it was convenient - the speakers were visible to put the keys on so they wouldn’t get lost. And the main hobby in those years was cars! Race! But many years have passed and here in Russia racing (402m) has lost its scope, and the price has increased; only a few remain in this hobby. So one evening I wanted to listen not to hard rock, but to jazz; I bought a disc by the singer Nino Katamadze. I turn it on, but I don’t hear what I would like! Too simple and muddy! I think I need to clean my head, a lot of time has passed, it’s clear that dust has accumulated. Cleaned it up. The device stopped playing completely. The time is around 23:00. Cooed. And the opinion of a layman far from audio pulsates in my head - CD and DVD players are cheap nonsense, with an abundance of BBKs and the like have no price on the market. I'll give you a thousand, well, a maximum of one and a half! I didn’t understand then how important the source was!! But in general, the sound of the Yamaha cdx-490 was more interesting to me than its competitors on the used market of those years at a price of approximately 4000 rubles. So, it’s late, but I want to listen, even more accurately understand what’s wrong. I find a used one from an ad
CAMBRIDGE AUDIO DVD86
, for 900 rubles!!!
In NEW condition, only a soft fabric bag under it, already costs 900 rubles + the name is several thousand (!) + aluminum aluminum control panel ! It should cost at least 10tr! I listen to all this magnificence day after day and quickly manage to change amplifiers and speakers like gloves. I can't find the sound! I’m not selling this device, there’s no point, its price is like going out to buy seeds! It plays something, but in totality, it’s all very very basic! There’s no point in describing the sound, connect any budget DVD, it’s still lifeless, but smooth, nothing sticks out, doesn’t bother you, but there’s no detail or taste! It can be compared to the speakers of English modern production, or more precisely, marketing - Castle Knight 3, beautiful, but there is no life in it. England
- this is a classic, a sample of sound (sarcasm detected)! And this is how I, a Russian, stepped on a rake and couldn’t understand it the first time! And I see they are selling
EXPOSURE CD 2010s
15tr
That's what prompted it?! It cost 56tr new in the store! It has the same splendor with an aluminum panel and a switch-off mode for the scoreboard. Darkness is the friend of youth; you can’t see your face in the dark. Everything is on sound! All the energy! Later I read the specifications: DAC PCM 1716 is a cheap one-bit unit. And the result of listening: I spent an hour switching cables from a Cambridge Audio DVD bought for 900 rubles (!) and back and couldn’t tell the difference, what did I pay for? Everything sounded at the “seemed” level. After an hour of torture, Exposure seemed a little more detailed. But there was no sound! There was marketing, advertising worked, so they took it away from me quickly! Looking at its price, I’ll express my opinion: THIS IS A DISGRACE!
Let's go back to Japan!!
We read, study, and begin to understand that a lot of things in diabetes are important! But even if you have the funds, it’s difficult to get the price level out of your head. There is also marketing on the forums.
Summary KENWOOD DPF-7002
, price 15tr
Not the lowest price at the time of purchase, but the choice was not only technical capabilities, but also excellent condition. WHAT ATTRACTED: The DAC, like the older model 7090, has 8 PCM1702 chips! According to the descriptions, a good DAC, multibit. We listen, everything is smooth, in moderation, details. Nothing forward, nothing backward, decent SD! But there is no transfer of emotions, atmosphere! I wouldn’t say that the sound is dead, it’s alive, but at the same time it leaves no impression, there’s no taste, there’s nothing to cling to, there’s no mood. It can be described as: the level is slightly higher than the initial level, I WANT MORE! But my brain resists spending money on something that just recently had no VALUE in my head.
TEAC CD-5
price 15tr
Manufactured in 1994, cost 65,000 yen SAA-7350 Delta Sigma DAC I left a very positive impression! In your budget. A little coolness gives amazing depth to the scene. This is exactly the kind of presentation, character, I was looking for. Not picky about genres! Yes, there are not enough details, everything is not so thorough, BUT it will not fall behind in its budget according to these parameters! The details are there, but perhaps not so expressive, behind some kind of veil, but there is a scene. Of course, there are no clear outlines of the scene, but all this can be forgiven for its sound as a whole, for the fact that any genre can be easily listened to. Plus an unusual design. Moreover, when choosing, there is such a thing - the devices are not new, so their maintainability and the price of this action are important. This model has a Sony kss-210a head, it’s not expensive, it’s not a problem to buy. In general, I raised this issue when choosing each device; I didn’t want to buy the device itself for 15 rubles and then spend the same amount on repairs! Teac worked perfectly without repair, I will say in advance that I did not have any problems with any device. The choice is always made carefully with an emphasis on excellent condition, and cosmetics will automatically tell you about that condition. Good device on a budget! Can be recommended. At the same time as the Teac CD-5 and the Denon DCD-1630G, the Yamaxa CDX-993 Pro Bit came to my test. I had impressions of my first Yamaha CDX and wanted to listen to others from the CDX series.
Yamaha CDX-993 PRO Bit
1998, 66,000 yen. Almost 10kg! Powered by our own 1-bit YAC-514 DAC. The player can be considered budget, but it has a completely mature sound. It blurs the stage a little, nevertheless there is air, depth of the stage, but there is no image or outline. But it plays with good resolution. Listening to 993 is already a pleasure. Nothing will fall into disarray, all genres. He plays evenly, emotionally, but without unnecessary emotions. The disadvantages of air filling can be attributed to its cost. At some stage it may well become a revelation and a step forward. Everything is musical, there is naturalness in the sound. At that time, I couldn’t say that I would like to have a Teac CD-5 (I liked its depth) or a Yamaha CDX-993 (it has higher resolution). Now I can say that the choice would be in favor of the Yamaha CDX-993. But I couldn’t sit still, interest grew! What else do you have? And I listened in the salon
Marantz CD-5004
price 25000r
Regular SD, warm. It was difficult to understand its level, since the amplifier was average! Having gotten used to the sound a little, you can understand that budget modern sound is muddy! I realized how cloudy it was by connecting the next SD device. This Marantz is easy to listen to because everything sounds cloudy and warm. Here is a budget option in modern Hi-Fi. And then they turned it on
Primare CD21
price 70000r!
The new device is based on a 2*PCM1728 DAC, in general it is a fairly simple DAC. Weight 10kg. Great performance! I was amazed by the transparency of the sound! Infinitely transparent! You can hear everything! If there is an echo, then it is transparent and tangible. Emotions! Initially, this is striking and hard to wrap your head around (perhaps after the muddy Marantz). All details! Sound ! It was on this wave that it was acquired. After a week I got tired of it, because everything is transparent, whether it’s a live concert by Eric Clapton or Metallica. Great for classics. And at used market prices 25-30tr. At secondary market prices back then, when the dollar was 30, there was something to think about and would you like it? And to look at the prices now, for the Primare CD22 of the new entry-level series costing 111 rubles, you can twist your finger to your temple. There are devices from the Japanese market that are two heads taller! In any case, 21 has its own highlight - incredible transparency! Nostalgic pause: I remember that in ancient times, when many people drove used Japanese cars, there was such entertainment as AutoZvuk. And then I built a system in a Honda Prelude for the crazy money of those years, $4000, and so before one of the competitions, by chance I replaced my Nakamichi SD with a Denon! I don’t remember the model, it doesn’t matter, but then I liked the result, there was a depth of sound, a scene!
Purchased Denon DCD-1630G
price 30tr
Handsome 1989, at the time of release the price was 79,800 yen. Weight: 10kg DAC 2*PCM1701 Interesting and beautiful device. Is there sound! Not what I was expecting. Plays brightly, EMOTIONALLY! It’s like I’m showing off, look what I can do and here I am in PORridge! The sound is warm, the details, the stage, everything is in place, but on one song it can become too bright and turn into a mess. Not a clear impression. I didn’t find the depth of sound and stage I wanted. I looked at its older brother - 1650, listened, I don’t remember exactly which version. It left the same impression, although there are many versions of the 1650 on different DACs. But I looked at the flagship DENON DCD-3500G with interest.
I bought DENON DCD-3500G
price 80000r!
Bought at the highest price! Due to the fact that, a flagship, a condition for collectors. The Japanese is working on this model, the restoration is not artisanal, but in NEW condition! Complete technical prevention, cosmetics like out of the box! Very thick layer of varnish! Not a trace of dusting! Year of release 1988, price at the time of release 228,000 yen! Weight 22kg!!
DAC 2*PCM64P, according to many descriptions, based on statements from vasiltech, is one of the best in the audio world!
The video was not filmed on camera.
This is a completely different level! The gap is serious from previous models! Everything is in place, depth, accuracy, speed, stage, image! Emotions and atmosphere of the room! I read that flagships from DENON are also prone to sound problems, but I didn’t notice! High level! The only thing I find is that the sound delivery is a bit harsh. They write that this DAC is unique, each crystal grown for it may have differences, so an expensive DAC and the sound may differ. Overall, a lot of impressions! Let's start looking at what is on this DAC?
Pioneer PD-2000LTD
price 35000r
1990 95,000 yen.
Let's look at the characteristics and excellent performance.
A decent device, with a good open sound! Of course, the same DAC will not reach the level of the Denon DCD-3500G, but we have a budget that is twice as low and the weight of this DAC is half as much. But the CD left a pleasant impression - the sound is accurate, depth, no coloration. If it's vocals, then there's the voice in the foreground. Jazz, the vocalist is exactly where she stands. Also, to my ears, there are very few harsh moments, but it played out its price completely, without pretending to be Hi-End with scene localization, but everything is emotionally consistent, there is no zest, but it’s not scary, for lovers of smooth, honest sound, you can use it in your budget . Good dynamics, high resolution. At the same time, there is no delight.
There was an interesting series from Pioneer, it is still in demand, we are looking for a player that is not Top in the series, but not an entry-level one. The budget plays a role these days more than we would like.
PIONEER PD-T05
price 38000r
1990, price was 80,000 yen. Weight 10kg DAC 2*SAA7350GP Interesting drive! The disc is placed with the readable side facing up. It has a very deep sound, even beautiful! From the first minutes there seems to be a lack of detail, but no! Here they are, the sound is somewhat viscous and sweet! Not for everybody. It's a pleasure to listen to, the resolution is excellent, the edges of the scene are not blurred. Perhaps it even creates a scene deeper than it really is. An interesting sound, it envelops you and pulls you into the abyss! Let this abyss be a little sweet and tugging, but not sticky! Not a bit tired from listening for many hours. An excellent choice for your budget. Take it only after listening. Not everyone likes this sweetness. A device from the past accidentally got into the load
Technics SL-PD887
Price 3000 rub.
They gave it to the load, it’s a shame to throw it away. And I need to refresh my memory of where I started. Interesting only to those who need a changer for 5 discs - ALL! For what? For me it was interesting only to make sure that I made the right choice in 2000. I bought speakers, and they gave me this CD and a two-block amplifier from the same series of music centers as a load. Why do they buy them? Here is an example of how marketing works. A lot of things for reasonable money, sad.
Now we have reached high-level devices!
Remembering the good impressions of the Teac SD in Japan, we buy
TEAC VRDS-25
price 80000r
Manufactured in 1995, price 180,000 yen Weight 16.5 kg DAC 4*AD1862N-J 20-bit, one of the best existing in the audio world
Those. Characteristics and performance, LOOK
Oddly enough, there is a lot of information on the Internet about how people do not like the sound of this CD. Everyone praises the drive, not complaining about the sound, some are embarking on the path of tuning and modernization. I disagree! Either these are people who listen not to music, but to what they have corrected and improved, or from a completely different budget. And the price for this model is high. In Russia you can buy it for 50 rubles, but not from Japan or Europe. I say - the devices are in perfect condition. It came to me from one owner in Japan, with all stands, documents, and in NEW condition! Sound: absolute balance. Highest resolution. Not just a scene, but localizing it! We don't just see the edges, but the image of the scene comes. When listening to a live Patricia Barber concert, a semicircular stage is visible, live sound! All the musicians are in place, during the concert someone’s glass falls from the table, we hear a real ringing, not artificial, not fake. By its ringing you can determine the floor covering. The sound is clear, you can hear each of the musicians separately without losing the integrity of the work for a second. That's what we're all looking for? The effect of presence! Teac VRDS-25 gives us this opportunity. After listening to it, you can talk about high-level sound. Next, it’s interesting how simpler models sound.
We bought and have been waiting for a long time TEAC VRDS-10
price 50000r
1992, price was 150,000 yen DAC 2*TDA1547 and SAA7350
Check out the specifications and performance here!
We also have impeccable performance / The sound is different from the 25th - there is no localization of the scene, but they have added air. The impression is that the sound was slightly blurred. These are disadvantages. But in general there are many advantages - sound resolution, depth, more air. We see that this is already an adult CD player, with a high level and resolution of sound. Listening to Diana Kral with her eyes closed, we see how excited she is about her performance. Its level is higher than anything in the range of up to 40tr on the used market, and in Russia we sometimes see this model on sale at a price that cannot be brought from Japan! We don’t see the edges of the stage, they seem to have been expanded, which is why we put it below the 25th. Looking at the situation, we have lower prices for Teac VRDS, so we buy it in Russia.
TEAC VRDS-7
price 29000r.
1993, price 100,000 yen DAC 2*SAA7350GP
Let's look at the characteristics and performance!
This model has the same DAC as the Pioneer PD-T05, but we have an absolutely unique sound. The character of the presentation is similar to the 25th model, but only with depth, a certain coolness in the sound. There is no localization, but there is a scene and its correct construction, the resolution is slightly lower, but the price is lower. Any genre is played perfectly, deeply, the presentation can be described as “exquisite”.
The edges of the scene are expanded, but this does not spoil the impression; they are not blurry, but wider. And the depth is simply an abyss.
Nice. Drowning in this is a pleasure, there is no viscosity and sweetness like on the Pioneer. Conclusion - an excellent CD player in your budget. How will the next Teac vrds perform after the 25th?
We bring TEAC VRDS-25X
price 106000r!
1997, price was 190,000 yen. The weight of the DAC is 16.5 kg, the same as on the 25th model. They were at different times, so I won’t tell the differences. It’s still the same beautiful scene with a full outline. Everything that I wrote about the 25th can be repeated here. Everything is great, but expensive. On the other hand, if you buy a new one in a store, for this price, then we will not come close to the level of TEAC VRDS-25 and VRDS-25X. What remains in my mind is the VRDS-25Xs, which seems to be the same DAC, but apparently the power supply and isolation are different. He gained 7kg weight. VRDS-50 is still in my mind, but I’ll tell you how it will be! Yes, other famous BRANDS - Copland, Wadia, McIntosh - produce their CDs based on TEAC VRDS. In a different wrapper and at undemocratic prices! Now I’ll tell you about my favorite player, I’ve had more than one and will have more. I would ALWAYS have this device in my collection!
Yamaha CDX-2000
price 50000r
1987, price was 180,000 yen DAC 2*PCM56P-K selected excellent 16-bit and YM3414
Features here!
Sound - wow! Abundance of air. The effect of presence is complete, the whole room is filled with air, all the actions on stage are here, with you. There are no limits to the action, because it happens to you and here. Very lively sound, regardless of genre, direction, all the details are as natural as in life. This is probably why there is complete confidence that Diana Krall is singing here in the room now, and even naked. The fact that we don’t see the shape of the stage is something we’ll leave to the listener to figure out, otherwise it would turn out that the band actually came to you and performed. The neighbors would be jealous. You can hear all the nuances of the recording, the atmosphere, the mood. Here are its advantages, AIR, ATMOSPHERE, MOOD, ALIVE in everything. At half the price! I can’t put it at a level lower than twice the price of the Teac VRDS-25 and Vrds-25X. Otherwise, YES! But not lower, precisely because of the complete sensation of live sound, NATURAL! The drive on this model is similar to the Jubilee CDX-10000, released for the 100th anniversary of the company.
Next year's model!
Yamaha CDX-2020
price 55000-60000r
1989 year of manufacture had a price of 182,000 yen Weight 15.8 kg DAC 4 * PCM58P-J selected best 18-bit and SM5813AP
Here are the characteristics!
The description of CDX-2000 fully suits this model, perhaps 2022 a little, at the level of replacing interconnect wires from good ones to better and more detailed ones, and 2000 is a little more airy. In general, on one path it is practically impossible to determine 100% which one is playing.
At the moment, my choice is the Yamaha CDX-2000 and CDX-2020.
In mind and TEAC VRDS-25 and its modification X Xs. I really wanted to have it in my collection, but for now, considering the price, it’s a Yamaha. It will always be in the collection based on the price/what we hear ratio. When the VRDS-25Xs appears, I will add to what was written, it’s very interesting myself. On occasion, having interest, we also have a modern Yamaha implementation.
Yamaha CD-S1000
the price of a new one is 80,000 rubles, on the used market 35,000-45,000 rubles
We have a laconic design, impeccable execution! Weight 15kg!! The device already reads not only SD, but Supper Audio SD. There are many descriptions and characteristics of it on the internet. We are interested in SOUND! One cannot help but compare it with the vintage CDX series. In general, the impressions are similar to the 993 (the CDX-993 has the makings of a very high-level sound, but you can’t help but feel like you didn’t invest enough! On the other hand, if you invested more, you’ll get a CDX-2000, again. Same with the modern 1000 there is a stage, all the details, the highest resolution. What they write is that the edge of the stage is blurred, it doesn’t bother me, all the action is in place, and if they created the edges, the price would go into unattainable figures (and they can come from the edge of the stage). Further, it’s as if you were describing an amplifier, absolute control over the entire range, it holds pressure, showing its power, but the air and what was alive in the CDX-2000 are not! We have a modern presentation, the sound conveys emotionally, but evenly, without dumping anything into porridge, everything is polished in detail, but there is no atmosphere of action. It reminded me of a good powerful German car. It is not correct to fully compare it with vintage devices that are more expensive than it. And remembering the modern ENGLISH CD sound, and the Primare CD21 which have the same cost, then the YAMAHA CD-S1000 will win here without hesitation.
